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 Post subject: Re: Future Pinball - Physic Overhaul
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2019 8:35 am 
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You can make a lot of tricks to avoid a potential problem in FP but in the end will not be the best solution for next table builders in the future, they could ignore this problem and in the front end editor they'll find a gate that will always create problems.

So the best solution for me is not to bypass the problem but to fix it.
...and at least is not even a big problem. The gate must be only calibrated to all the other parameters


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 Post subject: Re: Future Pinball - Physic Overhaul
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2019 9:40 am 
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GeorgeH wrote:
Popotte wrote:
You can consider toy (and rotate it with .Rotate) and invisible triggers.


I am basically finished with the table but are you saying to convert the gate to a toy and replace the trigger with an invisible one?

George

Yes.

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 Post subject: Re: Future Pinball - Physic Overhaul
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2019 10:51 am 
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Popotte wrote:
GeorgeH wrote:
Popotte wrote:
You can consider toy (and rotate it with .Rotate) and invisible triggers.


I am basically finished with the table but are you saying to convert the gate to a toy and replace the trigger with an invisible one?

George

Yes.


Do you know of any tables that use it?


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 Post subject: Re: Future Pinball - Physic Overhaul
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2019 3:11 pm 
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GeorgeH wrote:
Do you know of any tables that use it?

No. I've made some tests a long time ago (and it worked) but I don't find my test table about that... Sorry.

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 Post subject: Re: Future Pinball - Physic Overhaul
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2019 6:24 pm 
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GeorgeH wrote:
Do you know of any tables that use it?


The 3 entrance gates on each ramp on ID4 are toys, each one have a inv trigger, actually there are 2 inv triggers on each enter ramps, one is used to determine if the ball are coming from playfield and or from ramp.

I can probide the test table I made if any interested


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 Post subject: Re: Future Pinball - Physic Overhaul
 Post Posted: Wed May 29, 2019 10:59 pm 
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Ok guys what I'm doing now is the most important and difficult part of the work.

The new prehit feature introduced in latest Bam is really the game changer but I've noticed that all the tables with the new flipper physic has a big problem:
The flipper has too much dampening and friction power, this power helps a lot to have a better aiming but the feeling is something like playing with an homemade wooden pinball

Sometimes flippers absorb all the power of a fast falling ball, I've tried to enhance the bounce and remove some friction and flippers starts to be less precise than before.

Since the bounce is extremely important in real pinball to make many tricks, flipper change and many other things I've focused the editing on the mass, for flippers and even for the ball calibrating the dampening step by step. Is an hard work

The other problem was the speed of ball, by testing different frictions and dampening the ball is now faster without loosing the control over the ball.

Hope to share a table this week

Inviato dal mio GT-I9301I utilizzando Tapatalk


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 Post subject: Re: Future Pinball - Physic Overhaul
 Post Posted: Thu May 30, 2019 12:44 am 
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You might want to try the version of Jaws that Gimli and I posted here:

http://www.pinsimdb.org/pinball/table-2 ... s_ultimate

There are 2 versions of the table with different ways of creating bounce control. I wrote quite a bit about the 2 versions in the description. Both versions have a wide range of suggested entries included in the script.

Hopefully this will help if you haven't already seen it.

George


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 Post subject: Re: Future Pinball - Physic Overhaul
 Post Posted: Thu May 30, 2019 1:07 am 
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The upcoming fpx template uses the older code, but it does have 10 different settings based on the math from George.

here's one of the settings. The slow bounce is just math percentages of the main bounce code. There's 10 separate settings that is select able by changing one number, so very handy way to set the flipper bounce while testing. Maybe it will help out till you can have a look at the next build

Code:
SetflipperBounce = "Flipper Bounce Setting: Low2 .80/240/.07/.21"
         ' Fast settings (Ball speed>300)
         zbase_elasticCoef                        = 0.80                                           ' flipper rubber bounce
         zexpected_ball_speed_after_hit           = 240.00                                           ' calc elasticCoef to get desired ball speed after ball hit flipper
         zminimum_elasticCoef_to_scale_fast_balls = 0.07                                             ' we will add this to calculated elastiCoef, so ball after hit will have additional 20% of speed before hit
         zreduction_for_flipper_in_motion         = 0.21                                           ' if flipper is not in starting point, reduce elasticCoef by 15%

         ' Slow settings (Ball speed less than 400, usually for a cradled ball at flipper)
         ybase_elasticCoef = (zbase_elasticCoef-.10)                                               ' flipper rubber bounce
         yexpected_ball_speed_after_hit = (zexpected_ball_speed_after_hit-60)                      ' calc elasticCoef to get desired ball speed after ball hit flipper
         yminimum_elasticCoef_to_scale_fast_balls = (zminimum_elasticCoef_to_scale_fast_balls-4)    ' we will add this to calculated elastiCoef, so ball after hit will have additional 5% of speed before hit
         yreduction_for_flipper_in_motion         = (zreduction_for_flipper_in_motion-2)             ' if flipper is not in starting point, reduce elasticCoef by 15%

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 Post subject: Re: Future Pinball - Physic Overhaul
 Post Posted: Thu May 30, 2019 11:14 am 
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GeorgeH wrote:
You might want to try the version of Jaws that Gimli and I posted here:

http://www.pinsimdb.org/pinball/table-2 ... s_ultimate

There are 2 versions of the table with different ways of creating bounce control. I wrote quite a bit about the 2 versions in the description. Both versions have a wide range of suggested entries included in the script.

Hopefully this will help if you haven't already seen it.

George


Yes George, this is the first table that I've tried with the new flipper parameters. I was impressed by the precision of aiming but at the same time the ball movement was too much controlled if you understand what I mean.
it's really important to have a correct flipper physic, not only for the aiming, but even for the game, I mean....when you let the ball bounce on a dead flipper to send this ball to the other flipper, or when you make the famous "drop catch" and "Still stand pass"....all tricks that I always use when I play real or sim pinball, these are not accessories....these tricks are the essence of pinball gaming.


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 Post subject: Re: Future Pinball - Physic Overhaul
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 21, 2019 7:10 am 
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Ok, as said in the Monster Bash Topic, I'm trying to use only 1 physic for all kind of tables (EM, SS...) this is an hard work that requires a lot of testing but till now the playability is good, I've found some problems with ramps and sometimes with old flippers (T4 and T5) but the aiming is good and the general ball behaviour is trustable.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5x0vSaB_PE


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