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 Post subject: Re: JungleGirl (WIP)
 Post Posted: Tue Dec 31, 2019 5:34 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 11:13 pm
Posts: 434
Location: Abbotsford
Even better to me. :)

Still, noticed some bugs with BAM, but it may have to do with using integrated graphics (intel 620) like a light flashing very rapidly next to the right wood and around the flippers, (there's no light there at all and it doesn't do that around any of the other objects. May be a mistake in my dynamic shadows code) and if you notice in the code, I had to remark out the pf bulbs code as I used shaped lights for the plastic and if one set is above the other other, I lose the brightness and both sets go very dark. I will try this on my gaming computer, see if fixes that. Of course, asking a lot out of that intel, seems to be holding up though it crashes a lot again if you play the table a few times.

Thanks for your help George, I noticed a real bad bug last night, and forgot to change some graphics, so this is taking forever. Really not worth it, just another table among thousands, but learning new stuff for fpxEngine down the road.

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 Post subject: Re: JungleGirl (WIP)
 Post Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2020 5:07 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 11:13 pm
Posts: 434
Location: Abbotsford
Actually, figured out the flashing. it flashes with objects that "move" like the plunger gate wires, targets etc. A simple fix is to uncheck the anti alias in your video settings, that stops the flashing effect.

The crashing I believe may be caused by models. I loaded in a fpt file full of nothing but models (no script) and it crashed. Certain tables that are newer crash with newest version of BAM, but older versions do not. I'm speculating it could be complex models and New renderer doing it. Overloads the intel 620. JG is fine though, as there is no complex models in it.

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 Post subject: Re: JungleGirl (WIP)
 Post Posted: Sun Jan 05, 2020 1:17 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2011 10:02 am
Posts: 1902
Location: Argentina
Beautiful art, you have a lot of talent :D


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 Post subject: Re: JungleGirl (WIP)
 Post Posted: Sun Jan 05, 2020 3:13 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 11:13 pm
Posts: 434
Location: Abbotsford
Thanks, I consider it more of a struggle than talent though, and I keep screwing up or forgetting things like lens lights... :)

Still, after spending a couple days with BAM script, think I have it better. It lights better at least (hate really dark tables, can't see the ball) Maybe it's time to do that backglass now, hopefully the art I selected works for it.

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 Post subject: Re: JungleGirl (WIP)
 Post Posted: Sun Jan 05, 2020 6:19 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 11:13 pm
Posts: 434
Location: Abbotsford
Oh, as a aside. George pmed me on my flipper settings. I remembered my blues flippers technique, and have added it in to Jungle Girl. Plays far better now with the angle of the ball coming off the flippers, shots are far more natural. So, with Blues flippers, BAM dynamic flipper code, Zed Physics Code, some extreme settings in the xml, and a few custom timers, I have it at a more Bally like state. Maybe down the road a tutorial, as good as BAM is, it's still not right, so supplimenting it with various methods seems to greatly improve the aiming and behavior of the flippers.

In other words, I put every technique in a blender and pressed puree, and this is what I got. :)

Basically the fruit smoothie of FP.

Still some stuff that could be better, just don't want to take months playing with it. ;)

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 Post subject: Re: JungleGirl (WIP)
 Post Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 5:43 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 11:13 pm
Posts: 434
Location: Abbotsford
Tentative backglass. High res image at PN as this board post is at it's limits for files, and shame to make it too small. It's also at my facebook page if you have that. At PN, you can click the image for the dynamic image box, then right click and select view image.

https://pinballnirvana.com/forums/showp ... stcount=27

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 Post subject: Re: JungleGirl (WIP)
 Post Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2020 4:47 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 11:13 pm
Posts: 434
Location: Abbotsford
Cleared out some older files, and updated the very first post with the latest screenshot. Not a lot of lights on with this one, but you get the idea. This also uses New Render and has the Lighting code just added.

Still a lot to be done. I've been adjusting game play, fixed quite a few bugs, and adding BAM code which threw off a few things so had to fix that as well. There will also be a few new rule changes, a couple very familiar shots added, and a lot of cursing at fp's horrible physics for the next little while before I do the graphics changes and finish the backglass and art.

Plays very nice (despite fp not even being capable of doing smooth looping shots) play times are very long and the game is a bit easier than before. I decided though the table needed to be a bit more exciting so working on that now.

At the moment, settled on the dynamic flippers, and are using my double/flipper with walls, and threw out all the prehit code and rewrote it with forced omega settings. It's faster than Bally tables, but the flippers are very sharp, very snappy and has a lot of weight behind them. The generic code just doesn't work right for this table, the aiming is quite a bit off for a "shooters game" at certain contact points and doesn't have the speed for more centered shots, so consider JG to be "blues's flippers v3".

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 Post subject: Re: JungleGirl (WIP)
 Post Posted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 4:37 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 11:13 pm
Posts: 434
Location: Abbotsford
Progress with bug fixes and new BAM features has been surprisingly good. (for me at least) The cabinet is done, a screenshot is attached. Next is to look at the backbox image and decided if the object space is worth the extra lights for game over/match etc displays.

Worked on those flippers,added the walls from Blues flippers, but after a bit of experiment, the 2 small flippers are no longer needed, as I settled instead to make the omega values quite a bit stronger at the base. Just a brief tutorial here about this...

The problem was the size of the Bally flippers and how weak the shots were towards the center of the table. The ball barely made it to the 2 inside lanes of the table,and I wanted far more speed.

The Bam dynamic flippers are quite good, but they are more for the T1 flippers (williams) as opposed to the T4 flippers I use. (bally/gottlieb) Using the base code for the T4 flippers causes problems with the speed of the ball at the base of the flippers (too weak) and also changes the angle of the shot at the contact point of the flipper to severely. It is also harder to aim, and the ball at the tip of the flipper will send the ball into the bottom of the slingshot. (The walls correct that,and reset the angles better) As well, because the Bally flippers are smaller than the williams flippers, it means there's less surface area,and the flipper contact points are closer together, and FP has always had problems with contact points being too close together

With the Williams flippers, the code is
Code:
omegaCorrectionl = MaxOmega - (LeftFlipperExt.ContactPoint * ((MaxOmega - MinOmega)/1.2))
which divides by 1.2

I have found with the Bally flippers that the speed of very vertical shots is far better if it is divided by 1.05 instead of artificially increasing the set Min and Max Omega values.
Code:
omegaCorrectionl = MaxOmega - (LeftFlipperExt.ContactPoint * ((MaxOmega - MinOmega)/1.05))


Using the shaped walls and getting them right really helps the aiming as well,as it's my theory that FP physics are too extreme in the amount of angle it adds to the ball movement based on the contact point of the flipper. It's worse with the Bally flippers because the bally flippers are 20% smaller and have 20% less surface area than the Williams flippers.

If you are using Bally/Gottlieb type flippers, using this modification and the flipper wall method greatly improves the flippers and the shots if you take the time to adjust it. You will see Jungle Girl fpx soon, as I am getting there...


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 Post subject: Re: JungleGirl (WIP)
 Post Posted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 8:30 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 11:12 pm
Posts: 2601
Location: Arkansas, USA
I have noticed that the dynamic flipper coding does seem to work best for T1 flippers. I have noticed the code does not seem to work nearly as well on short flippers.

The reason that I divide by 1.2 is to make the omega value the same all the way around the tip of the flipper. You might understand what is happening if you substitute values in the formula for "LeftFlipperExt.ContactPoint". A value of 0 means the ball hit the flipper at the base. The max value is 1.2 which means the ball has hit the tip of the flipper. So if you substitute 1.2 into the formula for the contact point, you find that it equals the constant that you entered for MinOmega. ...So when the code runs this:

If LeftFlipperExt.ContactPoint > 1.2 then LeftFlipperExt.Omega = MinOmega

it matches the omegaCorrectionL around the tip.

My only point is that changing the 1.2 to 1.05 will result in reducing the omegaCorrectionL to somewhat less than the MinOmega. Then the code above will use the full MinOmega listed in the constant. So there will be a point of transition there.

If you don't want there to be a transition point, then you should change the other 1.2 values in the code to 1.05. This would make a smooth transition but also increase the area where the MinOmega is used.

...But then if your code works the way you want, it works. So be it. I only offered this to help explain how it works.

George


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 Post subject: Re: JungleGirl (WIP)
 Post Posted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 10:36 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 11:13 pm
Posts: 434
Location: Abbotsford
The problem with that is at 1.2 the tip shots are far to powerfull especially if you have to increase the maxomega to compensate for base flipper shots.

Add to that the bally flippers are 20 percent smaller so the contact points ate a lot closer together as well. The one problem is the strength of the tip and should be far weaker using just the straight math.

My maxomega is 42 all i actually need. Im writing the code to lower the tip tonight and maybe lower the maxomega point to around .8 instead as well as that was usually the strongest shot from the flippers in the arcades and because the top of my game has 2 inner lanes the shots there have to be stronger.

This is all done by eye which i guess is the main point. One code will only work on some games but not all.

I guess you will see what i come up with soon enough.

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